New Ideas for 2017: More Tower of Zenopus from The Tower of Zenopus

I named the blog after the adventure in the back of the Holmes Basic edition of D&D because that's where I started with RPG's. It was the first adventure I read and the first adventure I ran. It occurs to me that I haven't referred to it on the blog in years - about five years. As discussed in that post I am considering working up versions of that old dungeon for other games. I could work it up as the lair of a mystical supervillain easily enough for my M&M game. I could work it into Deadlands fairly easily as well. It's perfect as the old hideout of some dark side mystic in a Star Wars game. A Pathfinder conversion is trivial. Why haven't I done this before?

I'll let you know how it turns out.

Individual Initiative - the Curse of the Modern Age!

Oh look - it's Plan A. Again.

Let's talk about initiative.

I was once a big fan of individual initiative. AD&D 2E made it a pretty significant thing (and a lower number meant going sooner!), then for me personally Shadowrun, especially in 2E form, blew the lid off - with ridiculously souped up reflexes you might be able to act 3 or 4 times before some poor meatbag mook could pull a trigger. It was all about ME baby! The the d20 revolution took place at the dawn of the new millennium and ingrained it into an entire generation of players. I don't think I've had a party yet where someone didn't take Improved Initiative in the first 3 levels.

But there are other ways to handle it. Behold a passage from the Red Book of Moldvay!

Notice this - it refers to the side - not the individual! The side! Having seen it in play both many years ago and more recently with the Apprentices it really encourages a group approach to combat. Planning! Tactics! Letting the ranged characters shoot or cast before the melee types charge in shouldn't be a revelation but it is when someone uses this approach that either never has or has forgotten how much fun it can be!

I know some of you are saying: "Well you can do that in a d20 game, you just have everyone hold or delay until everything is set up."

This tells me you haven't actually tried to make this work in play. One thing we see from time to time is when Player A needs to hand a healing potion to Player B to administer to Player C. try doing that without rejiggering the initiative order in the middle of the fight. The other reality is that the barbarian who paid a feat for improved initiative isn't going to hold his action to let the bow ranger shoot first - he's going to charge! The rules encourage it both mechanically and with the spirit of the game due to the emphasis on individual initiative.

Timing is everything

Shocking Side Note: you can do pretty much anything with any set of rules. The feel of a game isn't so much what the rules allow - it's what they encourage. People play games with the "wrong" set of rules all the time and yet they somehow manage to have a good time. That said, it's good to find a set of rules that works with you  rather than against you.

Yes, you can try and force a group approach to initiative in d20 games but you're fighting the system - why do that? Why not modify it to make it easier in the first place, or try it in another game and see if you like the way it plays? See a few paragraphs below for one idea.

It wasn't just old school D&D  that did things this way:

Guess what game this is from? Hint: It has lightsabers and uses a bunch of d6's. It's about as far from D&D mechanically as you can get, and this version of the rules is about 15 years newer than the D&D rules above, yet per-side initiative was a good idea!

 Individual capability affects the order things are handled but only within your own side. But look - there's a way for an individual character to shine by giving his side the win with a high Perception roll! We have a 4th member of the trinity: Tank, Healer, DPS, & Initiative Guy!

To bring it in to the modern age, guess what approach the FFG Star Wars game takes?

Wait, what was I thinking? They're using individual initiative here! But wait ...

Look at that! There's a way to reconcile individual awesomeness with a team approach at the same time! Now the initiative works for you instead of handcuffing you. Think in D&D terms: The healer is often OK going last because they can move up behind the fighters and heal them after they get hit. But what if two fighters get hit hard in one round? Round one you go last, move up, heal PC#1, then in Round 2 you go first, move over, and heal PC#2. That's just one, limited example of how a flexible group-oriented approach to initiative can make a situation more interesting.

I've saved my favorite for last ...

This is the late, lamented, Marvel Heroic Roleplaying approach. The GM picks a player to go first. No dice, no numbers at all. one of the players gets to go first. Unless ...

So now we have some mechanics for breaking the standard approach, and it's harder to jump in front of faster or more perceptive heroes. This is one reason why supervilllains have henchmen.

Note the blue text there - the player who just acted gets to pick who goes next. Again, no dice, no numbers. If games at their best are a series of interesting choices, then this is a great example of one. The pattern of the new team typically is to let all of the heroes go first - yay team hero!

Well ... until this ...

 Then when the badguys get two uninterrupted turns to respond, well, things can get  ... dicey. My players learned pretty quickly to mix it up. It makes interesting choices for the GM too, as you weigh piling on with a bunch of mooks, or how exactly to break it down and keep an ace in the hole.


There are other interesting approaches to initiative - Savage Worlds card-based approach yields some interesting options with multiple cards and jokers while Runequest's strike ranks mainly apply to melee situations. The ones I am coming back around to liking best though are the ones that use mechanics to encourage team thinking as I assume would happen in the game world. Less "me" and more "us" makes for a more interesting game in my experience.

Tuesday: Two Things I Think

Catching up on a few weeks of news-type-stuff:

• Modiphius has a new license for a Conan RPG. Let's see there was the TSR Conan game, the GURPS Conan books, the seemingly cursed Mongoose d20 version ... is this really a big deal in 2015? I'm a pretty big Conan fan (original Howard books mainly, the movies to a point, the comic books and later authors less so) and this doesn't really get me excited. Part of that is probably because despite owning or having owned in the past all of those versions of the game I've never been able to convince my players to do a Conan game. Part is probably because I think GURPS did a pretty good job of it and Savage Worlds could do a pretty good job of it so I don't really feel the need for yet another version of it. I guess we will see how it goes. I'm also not sure it's ever made a decent amount of money for a game company as a licensed property but I suppose people will keep trying. Color me mildly curious.

• Looks like the same company also picked up the license for a new version of Mutant Chronicles. Awesome - a new edition of a game that wasn't that popular in the first place and the previous editions were put out 17 and 22 years ago. Maybe they hope to ride the nostalgia wave? I really liked the original version of the game and I still own a copy, but I think a big part of the attraction was an RPG that was about as close to Warhammer 40,000 as you could get when there wasn't a Warhammer 40,000 game available. Now there are at least 5 of them and they seem to be pretty popular, so who is going to play this again? For those who do like the setting, well,  I'm not sure I need yet another system for this when I suspect Hero, GURPS, or Savage Worlds (there is a SW conversion listed on the KS page) or even FATE could handle it just fine. They have some pretty big plans based on their Kickstarter too and that makes me pause as well - besides the actual core game there are a bunch more books and bags and minis and dice and t-shirts and other knick-knacks that seem to be the downfall of so many RPG crowdfunding efforts. I hope it goes well for everyone involved.

• History on the development of the "Known World" D&D setting is here. I still have a soft spot for this setting as it and Greyhawk were the first two published campaign "worlds" I encountered circa 1981. There was a lot here I did not know so I'd say it's worth a look if you're at all interested. 

• Excitement over WOTC taking down infringing apps here and here. I don't see anything terribly surprising here. If you're trying to make money off of WOTC stuff and you're not paying them for the privilege, they're going to have a problem with it at some point. Lots of comparisons to Paizo but Paizo is operating under the OGL with a lot of its content which changes things considerably.

• In a discussion on the new Sage Advice column at WOTC we already have people refusing to buy a perceived 5.5 edition of D&D. The DMG's been out for less than 2 months. I see internet gaming forums remain the bastion of rationality they have been for years now. Do some gamers really have this much trouble living in the now? Sheesh.

Morgansfort - The Western Lands Campaign for the Basic Fantasy RPG

To get to the point this is a much better adventure and starting point than JN1. It has a wilderness map, a base town, multiple low-level dungeons to explore, and even some named NPC's - with some personality traits mentioned in their description. It's an old school adventure so it has all the trappings of old school dungeons - puzzles, traps, wandering monster tables, rumor tables, and lots of the quirky things found in the old classics.

Why is this so much better than the Chaotic Caves? Because although it feels very much like the early edition adventures, it's not a direct rip of any of them in particular. There are goblins, undead, and giant insects, sure - but the maps and encounter descriptions don't read like they were cribbed from something else.

What makes it good? The whole thing instead reads like it came from someone's campaign and it feels very useable, a distinctive quality of a lot of the old adventures. They weren't weighted down with background overkill. They had just enough to whet your interest - a sentence, rather than a paragraph, or a page. They tended to be less about plot and more about exploring and overcoming the challenges within. They were meant to be dropped in to your game and run and this book clearly follows the same path.

I would run this with any of the old school systems if I wanted a solid area for kicking off a campaign without writing one up myself. It looks to me like it could be adapted to 5E pretty easily too if that's your inclination.

If you want an inexpensive older D&D-type fantasy RPG then this plus the BFRPG rulebook is a solid way to go.

The Chaotic Caves for the Basic Fantasy RPG

When I picked up Basic Fantasy, I also picked up "The Chaotic Caves", a beginning adventure for the same system. I had a longer version of this review written, but I scrapped it as I think I can make my point with fewer words. Let's compare this adventure to "The Keep in the Borderlands", home of the Caves of Chaos:

• One-page-square-gridded wilderness map in both? Check.
• Kobold lair in both? Check.
• Goblin lair in both? Check.
• Hobgoblin lair in both? Check.
• Bugbear lair in both? Check.
• Gnoll lair in both? Check.
• Undead lair in both? Check.
• Two Orc lairs in both? Check.

Now there are a couple of variations - the bandits and lizard men are moved into the cave area in "JN1" instead of being wilderness encounters as they are in "B2", and the ogre lives in a separate mini-dungeon instead of in the caves, but let's be clear here: this adventure is a straight rip-off of B2.

It's not an "homage" with a few nods to the old module. It's not a conversion of it to a new system. It takes almost every element of the most-published, most-owned, most-read, and most-played adventure in RPG history, rearranges some of them slightly, and then is published as a new adventure for a new system. It's a terrible way to do things and to me it looks really bad.

Here's why: If someone wants to play B2 they can just get a copy of B2! How about putting together something new for your new interpretation of Basic D&D? There is nothing even slightly new, innovative, or interesting here. Just as one example of the kind of thing I mean here take a look at The Haunted Keep here at Dragonsfoot. It takes the starter adventure from the Moldvay Basic book and expands it into a full 3-level dungeon. There is a nice combination of respect for the original material, connecting to something familiar, and new material.

When 3E came out one thing that was really popular for a time was the conversion document. These took an known adventure, typically a well-liked AD&D adventure like the Saltmarsh series, and put all of the stats for the creatures, magic items, and some relevant skill checks into a document with a numbered key that could be used alongside the original module. Something like that would have been welcome here too.

The closest analogy here that  I can think of is this: Have you read The Lord of the Rings at some point? After that have you read the Iron Tower trilogy by Denis L McKiernan? Did you walk away from it thinking you'd just read a lesser version of LOTR? That's the same feeling I had here. I think there is plenty of room to do something connected to KotB and the Caves of Chaos, but it's not this.

The copyright date on this one is 2009-2011 so this didn't come from some dark age - eBay and PDF's have been around for a while, as have used bookstroes and Noble Knight Games and other places.

My final point: As a level 1-3 adventure, a lot of people coming back to D&D type games in general and new to your game in particular might pick this up as their first expedition. Is this what you want them to play? Is this the best you can do? Shouldn't this be something that makes a strong positive impression rather than an edited version of an older starter adventure. I can see how people might like Basic Fantasy as a game, I don't see how the people creating it can be happy with something like this as one of their main starting adventures.

The Basic Fantasy RPG

I haven't really looked over a new OSR game in a while and then I came across this one while wandering around Amazon.  My "recommendations" have a whole lot of dungeon-y dragon-y type stuff so I didn't have to wander far. The price is certainly right (it's under $4 as I write this) and with Prime the shipping is free so what the heck. I've read it now and have mixed feelings about it so I thought I would share.

First up it's a pretty complete version of Basic/Expert-style D&D. It's not level capped, it has a fair selection of monsters and magic items and rules for cross country travel, followers, strongholds, etc. There are some odd choices regarding mechanics: race and class are separate but race has very little mechanical impact on a character - it mainly serves to limit class choice. The number of spells per level is ... small, but after looking back at my Cyclopedia's lists it's comparable so it's really only lacking compared to AD&D's lengthy lists. If someone is looking for an inexpensive one-volume B/X style game then Basic Fantasy certainly works.

The thing that bothers me though is that this is not really a new game - like a lot of OSR games. The vast majority of it is B/X D&D with a different editing job and some changes in mechanics for no clear reason. AC is ascending instead of descending, but it uses the old type of saving throws. Race and class are separate but  but there are some new restrictions on ability scores and hit points that shift them back to being very close to the old "race as class" approach. Thieves have the same old percentile skills fixed by level but the percentages are off by a few points from the table in the Cyclopedia, and not consistently! Some are higher, some are lower, some by 10% and some by 1%! Why? It boils down to what looks like someone's house rules or personal preferences, not some kind of effort to publish a truly new game with reverence for an old style, and at that point I have to ask why? Why take someone else's house rules for old D&D instead of making and using your own?

My questions aside, it does seem to have resonated with at least a few people. There is a fair amount of support on the website, much of it provided by players and DM's. All of the rules are free there so the only reason to pay for the book is to get a printed copy. The whole system is run as open-source and mainly non-profit, which is commendable enough. The people driving it don't seem to be terribly hung up on touting their own greatness which is refreshing as well.

In the end, I want to like the game but I keep coming back to this: I'm not sure what the point of this one really is. If I like the original, why wouldn't I play the original? This one is basically someone else's house rules, it's not strictly compatible with old adventures due to the mechanical changes, and it leaves out a lot of the later expansions and mechanical refinements. Sure it's simpler than 3E or Pathfinder or 4E but it's not simpler than other old school rules including the originals! It's not terribly challenging to go get a copy of the old D&D Basic or Expert rules if that's what you like. I see 3-4 sets on Ebay right now for $10 or less. The PDF is available on DNDClassics.com for $5! Heck, if you want the uber-original the Cyclopedia PDF is only $9.99! I know the PDF's weren't always available, but eBay's been around for a long time now.

How is this better than B/X D&D? To me, it's not. Heck, If I want tweaked old school D&D then Labyrinth Lord is closer to Moldvay Basic than this if I want "authentic", and its Advanced Edition Companion is a much more comprehensive effort to add in some of the player character options from AD&D. For this particular niche, I don't see myself using it a whole lot.

When would I play this? Maybe if someone was running Basic Fantasy specifically and I was really looking for an old school game, I'd give it a try. I don't really dislike it, I just like those other options better.

Bonus Note: Basic Fantasy is home to the greatest character sheet ever designed:

So ... it's not my cup of tea, but it clearly works for some people and if this particular flavor of D&D got you back into a game then that's cool. I'm going to look at some of the other material out there for it too and I'll post those thoughts here as well.

RPGaDay - Day 12 - Old RPG I stil play/read

How old is "old"? See yesterday's post for the oldest game I reread most recently.

I suppose it would have to be Moldvay Basic as I have run it several times over the last 5-6 years for friends and kids both.

Heck, Apprentice Blaster was running Apprentice Who through the Haunted Keep just a week or two back - summer vacation you know! It's a little weird to walk into a room and find my battlemat laid out on a table with a detailed map drawn on it and a bunch of mini's and character sheets scattered on and around it and realize that this happened without any involvement from me. It did make me smile though.

Honorable Mentions from the last few weeks:

• FASA Star Trek (80's) - research
• LUG Star Trek (90's) - planning, we might actually play this in the near future
• Deadlands (original flavor - 90's) - research as we are playing Reloaded now

RPGaDay - Day 5 - Most Old-School RPG Owned

Really?

See Days 1-3 for more.

Here's a post from last week that covers some of this ground as well.

Hers's another post on "back when" as well.

RPGaDAY - Days 1-3

Blogger RPG Meme for August?

OK, I'll play. Expect short posts, but I'll play.

It's an easy thing to catch up because the answer to the first 3 are all the same:

It's my first played, first DM'd, and first purchased. It was the only RPG I owned for a couple of years. Old posts about it here and here. I still have the contents, though the box is long gone. I picked up another copy of it a few years ago and that one is in pretty good shape.

The Apprentices vs. Stonehell - Session 3

Our heroes remain one elf ranger, one human cleric, one human monk, and one halfling assassin. Yes, the cleric survived the last session with a roll on the "what happens next" table, just needing some extra time to heal up from his vicious beetle-bite.

Heading out from the camp-cave they explored last session, the party moved along the right-hand (north) side of the canyon. Exploring the next visible cave entrance, things seem fine until the ranger spots mountain lion tracks. Knowing that's a pretty tough customer they decided to move on.

The next cave on the north face has a waterfall pouring out of it and down into a steaming pool. Quite a bit of time is spent discussing who and how to climb up to the opening - how good are our skills? How much rope do we have? How steep is the slope? Eventually this debate is settled and the party ascends the hillside. Now the debate is over entering the cave - some want to sneak but realize that the entire cave mouth is underwater as it pours forth down the hill, making stealth a much trickier proposition. It's also hot. There's some talk about wrapping chainmail in a blanket but the water complicates this solution. Eventually they decide to quit worrying about stealth and just sloshed into the dark, steamy cave.

Inside there was room around the edges to get out of the water. As they were entering there was also some discussion over light sources. As the rest of the group checked the cave the ranger started poking around the edges of the pool with a 10' pole and eventually detected something odd on the bottom of the pool, but could not see anything due to the heat of the water - it was just one big glowing hot spot to his infravision and torches were not showing much.

The monk was quickly nominated to go for an investigatory swim and took some burn damage jumping in but mastered the pain and continued on. He discovered a brass hemisphere at the bottom of the pool with no visible edges and no place to get a good hold. As he was feeling around he also realized that it felt like the water was coming out of this metal object, even though there was no spigot or opening of any kind. Intrigued but unable to move the thing he returned to the party and described what he found. Uncertain of the  significance of this find the party decided to head out and continue their survey of the valley.

The next opening was a carved stone doorway that led to an empty room, but exploring this triggered a low growl from the next room. Approaching, the party discovered a raccoon huddled in the corner. It turned to face them and was foaming at the mouth! Then it attacked, completely failing to harm the cleric's armored leg, and the party failed to hit it as it scrambled among them. Then the assassin lined up his blade and skewered the mad beast, killing it in a single stroke and ending it's misery.

Continuing to explore the party found a fairly extensive complex of rooms. Most were empty but there was a stone throne in one with an open pit in front of it. There was a stone table in another, behind a secret door, and they found some hidden treasure in it. One other room had a sandbag trap and no apparent treasure so they emptied out the sand onto the floor and left a message scrawled in it expressing their displeasure at anyone who would trap an empty room.

At this point there was a pause in the action - more next time!

DM Notes: This was a longer session than last time and a lot of fun even though there was not a lot of combat - it was a good reminder of the fun to be had with the "exploration" part of the game.

The mountain lion lair was empty, but they showed good instincts here in avoiding it.

The waterfall cave was an exercise in reminding them that there are not a lot of skills in this game - just tell me what you want to do and we will see if it makes sense. After the climbing was worked out the next debate was over sneaking with no sneak skill - which I pointed out that they had a monk and an assassin and  the ranger and cleric were not going to have a better chance than they would. For whatever reason they were very concerned with this and then totally dropped it. Then we had a discussion about light and whether someone could hold a torch in a shield hand - the answer here is yes, until combat starts - and who should carry it etc. We also had our first usage of a 10' pole! A very sensible one! 

There is a story about the brass hemisphere that emits hot water but there was no way they were going to figure it out this early. We will see if they remember it later on. The monk diving into hot water and trying to move the metal object spurred a quick review of the opening credits to "Kung Fu" and some speculation if he had tattoos before or after or if he now just had burn scars on the inside of his arms and whether they could find some aloe in the valley.

The battle with the raccoon lasted all of two rounds and was the only combat in the whole session. Best line after the fight: 

"I'm going to go check his bed" 
"What bed? This isn't Narnia, he doesn't have a bunch of little raccoon-sized furniture in here."

This earned me an annoyed look from the birthday boy that turned into a snicker as the brother took up the theme and started throwing in his own narnia contributions. It was pretty funny after this rather rapid fight.

Exploring the the rest of the place brought back the opening doors and searching for secret doors parts of the rules. The stone table ("no there's not a lion strapped to it" - pause, cackles) provided the only treasure of the night. 

The sandbag trap really annoyed them as it was at the end of a series of empty rooms on a night with one combat and one small treasure:

 "So it's a bag full of sand? On the end of a hanging rope tied to the door?" 

-Quick checks for secret doors, searches for treasure, nothing is found -

"Who would do that?!"

So they emptied it out and wrote a message in common as described, and decided they would check back every once in a while to see if anyone answered.

It was a lot of fun but I'm hoping they actually get to the main dungeon next time and start really digging in to the meat of the adventure.

The Apprentices vs. Stonehell - Session 2

This was a short session as it was already late when we sat down to play. Apprentice Who was already headed for bed so this was once again just Blaster and Red. Blaster's cleric recovered from his beating in session 1 and Red rolled up a monk of all things to replace his dead fighter.

They decided to explore one of the caves on the opposite side of the canyon. Inside they found a dirty room with a message written on the wall that only the elf could see - something about jewels! Beyond this they had a passage to the left, a passage to the right, and a door straight ahead. They went for the door.

Breaking open the door they discovered a storeroom - crates, barrels, and the smell of mildew. Ransacking the room (like any good adventuring party would) the ranger managed to discover some green slime on one of the crates and so the party got a quick lesson in hard cures as they figured out that only fire was going to stop the stuff from consuming the adventurous elf. Somewhat annoyed by all this (and the lack of loot to be found) they moved on to the right and found a largely empty room that had been used as a campsite. Then they went back down the hall to the last unexplored room.

Approaching, they notice a red glow ahead. Unsure what this might mean the halfling assassin tried to sneak down the hall to take a peek but completely failed at this and the rest of the party was only too happy to point this out. Plan B was "charge" so charge they did! Into a room with a large beetle eating a goat - a beetle with a red glow coming from it's underside, lighting up the room! Battle begins and the beetle charges the party to drive them away from its meal, ripping into the cleric and dropping him in one chomp - ouch! Blows are exchanged and the party manages to slay the insect with no further casualties. They decide to camp there for the night and pick up again the next day.

DM Notes: Did you know Advanced Labyrinth Lord Monks have a percentage chance to kill anything they hit? I didn't until Red pointed it out to me - where did that come from? It's a small chance, and at first I thought it was only applicable when they stunned an opponent but the example makes it appear as though it applies to every attack. Weird. 

The flame chalk message confused them a bit as they assumed the jewels would be in this room complex, not somewhere else in the dungeon. Once they hit the main door I think this will start to clear up.

The green slime was fun as they have run into it in 4E in the moathouse but the rules are different so they weren't sure what to do with it here but they figured it out without too much damage.

This was a short one but they had fun and cleared out one small cave section -  the surface level seems to be good for this kind of thing as it has lots of little areas that exist as their own thing and enabling the party to come and go. Hopefully we will get time for some more this weekend. 

The Apprentices vs. Stonehell - Session 1

(Prologue is here)

I told the Apprentices what I was thinking - that it would be nice to have another fast-D&D option - and they agreed. Apprentice Who was sick so he sat out this round but Red and Blaster were ready to go.

The first part of the experience was making characters. I told them 3d6 in order. There were frowny faces but no real griping other than "you know that means we're going to suck, right?". I tried to gently push them forward with the whole "part of the fun is overcoming the odds with a less than perfect character" D&D dad speech but it's clearly not a huge plus in their opinion. I did give them the chance to swap two attributes around, and that made them pretty happy - briefly.

We are playing advanced Labyrinth Lord so we have all the races and classes from AD&D and Blaster was shocked by the stat requirements for a Ranger. Subsequently Red was shocked at the Paladin - "Who has a 17 Charisma?" was the comment I believe.

Sir Not-Appearing-In-This-Campaign

Apprentice Blaster was subsequently shocked to find out that Elves cannot be Rangers! His favorite race can't be his favorite class! SMACK! Welcome to the good old days son! Actually I used to think that was stupid too so I eased up here and pretty much let races access to class = race access to subclass as well. We'll figure out the level limits and stuff when it matters.

Anyway we ended up with an Elf Ranger (surprise surprise) and a Human Cleric for Apprentice Blaster, then a Half-Orc Fighter and a Halfling Assassin for Apprentice Red. They have names but we will not concern ourselves with those names until they reach 2nd level.

Couple of interesting things here:

• I like the idea of the halfling assassin so I allowed it. between this and the elf ranger thing I decided to just go with the tentative class = sub-class general guideline for now. Plus the advanced LL assassin doesn't have all that gray area stuff around what the table is for - it specifically says it's a chance to flat-out kill something under a couple of easily-met conditions. 
• Half-Orc fighter ... those were fairly popular back when in some of my circles, a very traditional choice and with no prompting from me
• Clerics - My background for the religions in this world is different than what I usually run and pretty loose so I told Blaster to make up whatever god he wants his guy to follow and tell us about it. He and Red immediately say "Talos" and start singing something from Skyrim and just tickling the heck out of themselves so apparently I need to play more Skyrim to start getting the jokes. 

This was all arranged very much on the fly so as they finished up character creation I handwaved a lot of travel time and said they headed straight for Stonehell when they left the great city of Dragonpoprt, bypassing the local town  in order to get right to the dungeon.

I'm sure it looks something like that

Stonehell is located in a box canyon which is walled off by a 20' stone wall, kind of like Helm's Deep without the fortress part. It's partially collapsed but the central section with the gatehouse is still intact. The canyon has some cave openings ala Caves of Chaos, plus there are some terrain features inside the canyon too - in short there are a lot of places to check out before entering the dungeon proper. They stopped to read the graffiti on the outside of the wall (treasure promises, warnings, etc.) and then went inside.

First stop was the first entrance on the left - empty, empty with big stone thing in the middle of the floor, then NOT EMPTY! Yeah, skeletons! A few minutes later and the skeletons are smashed to bits around the room and no one died!

Small, rubber skeletons, apparently - like these!

Encouraged by this they decided to check out a small wooded area and they manage to surprise a group of brigands waiting in ambush! A very one-sided fight breaks out and the brigands go down faster than the skeletons did, though they manage to get in a few licks in on the party.

Backtracking a bit they decide to enter a cave when the ranger notices some bear tracks and they hear a low growl form within -  a bear growl. Realizing this is likely the lair of the local mascot and good luck charm they decide to back off and check out some other options.

Heading up a nearby trail the neophyte heroes come upon a new cave with non-mascot wildlife - wolf tracks! They charge in and the wolves attack! In a flurry of vicious blows a wolf is wounded but the cleric goes down in the first round. Shocked back into reality a hard fight begins and goes on for 8 whole rounds, taking out all 4 wolves and only claiming the fighter's life along the way as an additional cost. The now somewhat less cocky party gathers up their things and heads to the nearest town, to bury the half-orc, help the cleric recover, and recruit some help.

Oh it wasn't THAT bad

DM Notes: Hey, I tried to get them to check out the hireling rules but they were not interested. All went well and they used appropriate caution until the wolf episode and well, hopefully they remember that. 

• The binding wounds rule worked well so we're definitely keeping that. 
• Assassination is not a hugely useful ability at first level as quite a bit of the time a backstab is enough to kill your target anyway - Red kept asking about rolling for assassination until I finally told him that you don't a special table to kill things with 5 hit points. Then of course with the wolves he really didn't have a chance to use it anyway.
• They got distracted trying to parley with the brigands until I reminded them that they had surprised the goons and that talking to them first would automatically skip past that. They opted to attack instead. They did track them back towards their lair, so that could be an interesting development for next time.

It was a promising run and they were amazed that we got that much exploring and fighting done in the time we were actually playing. That's a good way to start and next time we should accomplish even more as we won't have quite so much character building to do. 

Labyrinth Lord and Stonehell

So ... went a little retro over the weekend. Why?

Sometimes, after months of running 4E, as much as I like it, the pace of 2 or 3 encounters per session wears a bit. I'm in the mood for something faster. In the past this usually prompted another trip to the Caves of Chaos or Quasqeton with the Apprentices, but at this time last week I was seriously looking at playing another round of Next ... with the Caves of Chaos and some hope of moving on to the Isle of Dread which is also a part of the playtest packet now.

But ... the boys still have a bad taste in their mouths from that failed experiment last year and I don't want to have to argue them into a game. I've tried having them read it before but since it's a LOT of text and "it's a test version" reading it loses out to talking smack to their friends on XBOX live. Also, I've spent a lot of time in the Caves and it might be nice to have something totally new to explore for all of us.

Poking around online turned up some possible options but then I ran across Stonehell and after reading some reviews and flipping through the preview I decided to make an impulse purchase. It's big enough to run for a long time but I don;t need to keep up with 30 pages of notes for each level - that almost-one-page-dungeon format it uses hits a sweet spot for me for this kind of game. I went ahead and printed out the upper section but I suspect I could run it from an iPad if I needed to.

Then I got to looking at what OSR system it used - lord knows there are enough of them out there these days. Ah, Labyrinth Lord - OK, I have that, it was pretty much Moldvay Basic, right. Flip flip flip - yep. Ah, but I don't really want to go back to Elf as a class, we already have that in the B2/B1 game. Ah-ha, Advanced Companion. It's an adaptation of the AD&D races and classes to fit into B/X type games - that should do it. My main motivation here is that I don't want to have to do any conversion work to run this - I'm doing enough of that on the 4E campaigns. I want to run it as-is and see where things go without that extra layer of processing/preparation that comes with  a conversion.

So I had an adventure and some rules - what else is out there? Couple of cool things:

• The B/X headgear table - hey, we're going all the way here. I want the Apprentices to understand it's OK to have fun with this and not be too serious.
• Meatshields - the henchman generator! I can't tell you how much I like this thing - it's funny and in the spirit of the game and all that stuff and I hope it stays up forever.
• The Labyrinth Lord combat wheel - I remember the AD&D combat wheel that came out in Dragon and once I put that together I stopped using the charts completely.It's a handy thing to have. I haven't put it together yet but I expect it will be a big hit when I do.

I'm sure there are others but these 3 stood out to me.

I also added some house rules:

• Jeff's Carousing Rules - I finally get to use these!
• Chop When They Drop - because everybody likes Cleave
• Dutch Courage - because it helps
• I use Claw Carver's binding wounds rule because I like it better than my old one: Immediately after combat a wounded character may receive “first aid” to restore 1d4-1 hit points lost during that combat. This healing may be administered by the character him- or herself (if conscious!) or by a companion.
• And Shields Shall be Splintered, of course.

Splintered!

Characters die at -10 hp (it was good enough for AD&D it's good enough here) A failed "save or die" roll does not cause instant death but drops you to 0 hit points and you immediately begin the death spiral of -1 hp per round until aided or you reach -10 and die. This applies to poisons and death ray type effects. Petrification still turns you to stone, Massive damage still does massive damage, etc. Someone hit by poison can be stabilized at 0 hit points but cannot regain consciousness without a potion or spell effect to neutralize the poison. 

Level drain effects allow a saving throw and drained levels return at one per week, assuming you are not turned into a wight during the battle. 

Also, I added a tweak for weapon usage: Using two weapons gives the user a +1 to hit, using a weapon two-handed gives the user a +1 to damage. At one point I tried out letting the two-weapon user roll 2d20's and use the highest but that was too much. I think toning it down to a +1 should make it interesting without overpowering the thing. The two-hander bonus helps bump up those weapons just a bit to make the player feel like he's made a choice that matters without overpowering that option too.

Anyway there is the thinking and the rules tweaking - next up is the action report.

Reflections on editions and changes over the years - Basic & AD&D

I started with a Holmes Basic Set that I bought in a K-Mart in Tennessee in 1979. I quickly became aware (throgh the toy store in the mall) that there was an Advanced version and over the next two years I started procuring those - it's a longer process when you're running on allowance, lunch money, and Christmas and birthdays - but we typically start off characters in Basic and then moved over to Advanced once every had things figured out. I moved a few times in those years so I started a new group more than once.


I know that at the time I didn't see Basic to Advanced as a different system or an edition change the way we see them now. I saw it as a natural progresssion - Basic covered the basics, Advanced added in the rest. Of course once the Moldvay sets came out, especially Expert, that was clearly not the case, but I was mostly playing AD&D by then anyway. I was happy to play in a Basic or Expert game if someone ran one, but considered my self an AD&D player first and foremost.



For me, the 1st edition of AD&D was a time of excitement – there were new adventures on a regular basis,there was new stuff in The Dragon every month, and my friends and I were doing this all for the very first time! There was a lot of cross‐pollination back then as there were articles on Traveller and Champions in a magazine that was mainly about a different game. We played it for years, constantly playing around with new rules from the magazine or things we thought up or trying out some of those rules we had always ignored before like weapons vs. armor type or the as‐written unarmed combat system, so while it was really never in a completely settled state we always thought of it as the same game and we loved it.



So we spent the 80's playing AD&D as our #1 game and we played it a LOT. Multiple characters, multiple gameworlds, multiple DM's, rules tweaks wise and unwise, and it filled out summer vacations and our weekends and any other days off and even some after school time. We played other games too, but AD&D was the center of it all. I doubt I have played any other game as much, and I doubt I ever will. I like to think we get more out of them now with the background and the understanding that we have now. but I'm not absolutely sure about that. We played a lot, and quantity has a quality all it's own.


As good as it was, by the late 80's there were a lot of things people saw as flaws in the game and when word got out that a new edition was in the works there was both excitement and concern but we were young and eager to soak up any new set of rules - even one for AD&D.

House Rules for the Dragonport Campaign

I haven't posted much about the Basic D&D campaign lately but I have been working on a map using Hexographer and considering some house rules for the game. The map will come later but here are the rules as they stand several months into the campaign.

First the old ones:

• Max hit points at 1st level 
• Natural 20 to hit = maximum damage for that attack
• Natural 1 to hit = dropped weapon unless shooting into melee, in which case it means an ally is hit
• 0 hit points= unconscious, not dead. You then lose 1 hp per round until aided by another or you reach -10 at which point you die.
• Anyone can "bind wounds" as their action for a round or after combat. Binding wounds adds a d3 hp to a wounded character and wakes up an unconscious character. It does nothing for a dead character.
• Monster XP = 100xp per hit die
   

Original discussion of these is here.

 New ideas that I am looking to implement:

Style Options

• Using a single weapon with nothing in the other hand grants a +1 to hit for melee attacks with that weapon
  This is to explain and allow the Duelist or Swashbuckler type character seen in the artwork sometimes
• Using a weapon in each hand allows a character to roll the normal damage die for one of the weapons and a d6 then take the higher of the two for their damage.
  This is to give some kind of mechanical system for using two weapons in the game which has been requested
• Using a two-handed weapon lets the user add a +1 to the damage roll on a successful attack
  This is mainly to give two-handers a small bump to keep them even with the other choices. It also means battle axes do a little bit more than a sword in exchange for being a two-hander 
• Using a weapon and shield means that attacks happen as normal but the wielder can benefit from the new shield rule below 

Shields shall be splintered

• Shields shall be Splinntered is in effect. the original post by Trollsmyth is here but here's a summary
  You get the usual -1 to your AC with a shield. However, any time you take damage, you can opt instead to say your shield absorbed the force of the blow. The shield is shattered and must be discarded, but you don't take any damage from that hit. It's quick, it's easy, and it's valuable. My take on magical shields is to allow them one free "splinter" per day per plus saying they regain their power overnight.
  My take on using them against magical attacks is that  instead of soaking up an attack a player can "splinter" one to automatically succeed on a saving throw against a damaging spell effect, and yes you can wait until you fail against it just like you would splinter after a successful to-hit roll

I'm still debating whether to restrict these options to certain classes or even whether to go with the full weapon mastery rules from the D&D Cyclopedia. For now I like these simpler options better.

For all characters:

• A failed "save or die" roll does not cause instant death but drops you to 0 hit points and you immediately begin the death spiral of -1 hp per round until aided or you reach -10 and die. This applies to poisons and death ray type effects. Petrification still turns you to stone, Massive damage still does massive damage, etc.
• Someone hit by poison can be stabilized at 0 hit points but cannot regain consciousness without a potion or spell effect to neutralize the poison 
• Level drain effects allow a saving throw and drained levels return at one per week, assuming you are not turned into a wight during the battle. 

This is my attempt to mitigate the nastiness of some of these effects as right now they are devastating to a party. I know it used to be that way but most people I knew hated them back then too, and now I'm in a position to do something about it.

They are bad mainly because there's nothing the player can do to stop them - you can play a dwarf in plate with a shield and carrying a potion of neutralize poison, but if the spider hits and you roll a 3 to save, you're dead, despite taking all the sensible precautions that you could. If someone gets to you and administers the potion then you may come out alright but that's a big if, and if you don't have such a potion you're just screwed. I've considered making it a form of ongoing damage to give a character time to drink his own potion instead of making them dependent on another character but I'm stopping short for now.

For level draining I'm also thinking about adding in a restoration spell (maybe a level 3 cleric spell).

One thing I am very much against when house-ruling old school D&D is complicating the game, I'm working on a separate post about why someone would play Basic D&D nowadays  and one of the reasons is the simplicity. Most of my house rules do not require any additional die rolls or make one divergent mechanic work just like another one in an attempt to keep things as simple as the rest of Basic D&D.

Thinking through all of these house rules also got me started thinking about a more drastic option too, but that's another topic for yet another post.

Stretched Metaphors - D&D Editions

This occurred to me late one night and I decided to share it, for what it's worth.

• Original D&D is like the cool underground black and white comic that spawns an empire, like TMNT
• Basic D&D is the cartoon based off of that comic and is how most people are introduced - a cool after-school cartoon like Transformers or GI Joe that gets people interested in finding out what else is out there. (Expert is the second season where it gets really good, Companion is where it starts to get weak, and Masters/Immortals is the Japanese version that bears almost no resemblance to the original other than some names) 
• AD&D 1E is the mainstream Marvel version of the comic - bigger and bolder and now in color but some still think it was better when it was an indie thing
• AD&D 2E is the live-action TV show that's a little cheesy and is revised to be more family-friendly (no more demons and the half-orc assassin gets replaced by a female character or a robot or something.)
• AD&D 3E is the 20-years-later-cool-re-imagining of the original show, like SciFi's Battlestar Galactica (It also falls apart in the end game, just like SciFi's BSG) and some of the original participants hate it at first, then get on board, fueling a sort of renaissance.
• AD&D 4E is The Movie, specifically The Action Movie. If the series had one big stunt or special effect per episode then The Movie has a big one in every scene. It uses a different cast, a different backstory, and a different special effects house. The differences spark an uproar among the fans and a schism too.

Discuss, Rip, or Ignore - that's sort of how they all sort out in my head.

The New Old Campaign - Part 11: The Fungus Among Us

Back at Falcon Keep (the Keep on the Borderlands) our heroes gear up for another expedition. This time they plan to head back to the solitary cave they discovered (The Cave of the Unknown) and explore more of the dungeon within (which is Quasqueton or B1: In Search of the Unknown). Our heroes are:

• Willem the Thief - 3rd lvl
• Apollo the Elf - 2nd lvl
• Orrick the Dwarf - 2nd lvl
• David II the Halfling - 1st lvl
•  Skullduggery II the Magic-User - 2nd lvl
• Horus the Dwarf - 2nd lvl

This time the trip to the cave is uneventful and they quickly scout out the interior. Not wanting any part of the Ochre Jelly in the eastern half of the dungeon, they decided to explore more of the western side. This led to a lot of moving through dusty, empty rooms. They eventually found the fungus garden and while poking around disturbed a crab spider. As it attacked - scaring the bejeezus out of the players when they realized it had a poison bite - the party tramped all over the garden, disturbing another spider and making the battle that much more exciting.

The fight is short but brutal, as both spiders end up dead but Horus and the one remaining hench fighter both end up poisoned. Scrambling around the hall of exotic fungi the rest of the party manages to put together something they think will stop the poison and they feed it to the downed pair. Miraculously it works and after a short rest the group is back on their feet, ready to explore.

 Heading for the northwestern section of the halls they hear noises and proceed cautiously, arranging the party in a hall-fight formation. As it turns out, just in time, as they encounter a band of giant rats exploring the hall and moving in the opposite direction. After a short fight the rats lay dead and the party has suffered only a few scratches. They prepare to move on...


DM notes: This was a nice productive session that didn't take a lot of time. The Ochre Jelly in the pool room really put the fear of dying into them so they want no part of that side of the dungeon even now, months of real-time later. I had not put much into the part of the dungeon they went for first and that was probably good as they  had a chance to explore and get their confidence back up.

The Spider fight was fun but it did remind me of some of the differences between old D&D and newer D&D. There were really no terrain rules back then. I gave them some cover modifiers for moving into the fungus forest and setting off clouds of spores but there was nothing in the module and if it was a 4E game I probably would have worked up all kinds of weirdness in advance. For this I mainly went with a +2/-2 for various conditions. I also was reminded of how much I dislike instant-death poison - hated it then, hate it now. In this case if the PC fails his save vs. poison then they die in 1-4 turns. That's pretty harsh at low levels and with no magical healing. Since they were in a fungus garden I gave them a wisdom check to come up with an "antidote" that would give a poisoned character another chance to save upon consuming it. They managed to make a few doses (each un-poisoned character got one check) and the re-saves were successful, so they felt pretty good.

We then wrapped up with the rat fight in the hallway which was a nice straight-up fight - no traps, no engulfing, no poison.

For the "poison" problem I am thinking about possible house rules. One idea I am toying with is adding the condition track from Star Wars Saga Edition to the game. Something like a Crab Spider would inflict a -1 on the condition track with a failed save. Stronger poisons might inflict a -2 or more. It might even work with petrification and the like, so that if you go all 5 steps from one of these attacks you pick up a persistent condition that doesn't go away until the proper spell is cast or potion is drunk - neutralize poison, stone to flesh, etc. It's just a rough idea but it would eliminate the all-or-nothing element and give the players a chance to strategize or even retreat from a bad situation  rather than losing a character to one bad roll. I don;t want to over-complicate Basic D&D (simplicity is kind of the point) but I don't like losing a character in every other session either and this might be an acceptable compromise for us.

The New Old Campaign - Part 10

Back at the keep Orrick the Dwarf joins the group as a replacement for the fallen fighter (lost to an Ochre Jelly last session) while Skullduggery II digs into his spellbook and does some magical detecting on the treasure discovered so far. He realizes that he has been carrying a wand of paralyzation ever since the encounter with the evil magic-user back in Session 1! He also determined that the Eagle shield found by Horus was a +1 magical shield. He also takes Charm Person as his second spell, having levelled up to 2nd. Fortified, they now decide to head back to the Caves of Chaos instead of facing the horror that lurks inside Quasqueton.

Reaching the caves the party decides to see where their onetime orc companion lives and enter that cave. They pass a wall decorated with the heads of former enemies of these orcs and enter a guardroom. As fighting breaks out a second wave of orcs crashes in from behind, but the heroes are victorious nonetheless. Exploring further, they end up pinned in a large storage room with a large number of orcs and the orc chieftain bottling them up. Sensing his moment, Skullduggery casts Charm Person at the pig-faced leader.

Smiling, the orc chief walks in, arms wide, and greets his new old friend. Weapons are sheathed, backs are slapped, but language is a problem as no one in the party speaks orcish! The party moves to leave but not before Skullduggery is gifted with an ogre head and a solid, almost mournful handshake from the chief.  The group makes camp up the road a ways and discusses what to do next. 

The next morning the band heads for a different cave covered by a small wooded area. They move in but as they come to a T intersection several things happen: 

-The two dwarves at the front of the party disappear from view as they fall into a covered pit trap which promptly closes again, leaving them cut off from the group

-A group of small doglike reptile things pops up in front of the party and begins throwing javelins at them

-Another group of the things drops out of the trees and charges the party from behind

This is a terrible tactical situation as the party is reduced to 4 members -Elf, Halfling, Thief, and Mage. Combat lasts a long time and numerous weapons are dropped, bowstrings snapped, as general unluck seems to have taken over the battlefield. The Elf is badly wounded, as is the mage, but the halfling and the thief fnally finish off the kobolds, even dropping one who attempts to flee. The wounded are patched up while the dwarves are freed from the pit and the whole group heads back towards the keep.

DM Notes:

The apprentices were not at all interested in going back to B1 this time so they decided to check out the orc lair instead. They ended up cut off in the storeroom with about a dozen orcs outside who called for the chief. Fortunately the MU remembered that he had Charm Person and was eager to try it out and this led to the realization after it worked that no one had taken the orc  language. This was pretty funny and worked out nicely in the end. 

They decided to try a different cave and ended up in the nasty kobold ambush in about as bad a situation as they could be in with their two heaviest melee hitters unable to contribute, but they survived with no losses. This did show them that non-fighters could do alright at fighting though, which is probably a good thing for the long run.

I took time at the beginning of the session to remind the M-U player that he had other spells besides magic missile that might be useful at the keep. He had forgotten some of this so it helped to have a refresher as he leveled up to 2nd. Hopefully he will start using his spells more from now on - he certainly did better in this session.

Overall I am happy with the campaign so far - we're starting to see some leveling-up and some good instincts develop through both common sense and hard experience. Everyone is having a good time so we plan to continue for a good long while.

The New Old Campaign - Part 9

Picking back up in the dungeon, our heroes have ventured deep into level 1 of Quasqueton with the game paused near the throne room.

Continuing their explorations, the party discovers several empty rooms including the room of the apparent captain of the guard and discovers stairs down, but decides not to take them just yet. Moving through more hallways they eventually come to a huge irregularly shaped room with numerous pools spaced regularly throughout. 

Splitting up they each move to a different pool and begin examining the contents. Sniffs are taken, arrows are poked into various liquids, and some deductions are made, many correct, some not. There is a pool of cold water, a pool of wine (which almost puts the dwarf to sleep but he is able to fight it off), a pool of acid, a pool of green slime, a pool of dry ice - all are checked and nothing terrible happens. The one more pool is poked with a sword...

The non-carpet-carrying henchman uses his greatsword to prod a pool that has some swirling shapes within. It rears up and slaps him with a pseudopod, slaying him instantly, sword clattering across the floor. The thing in the pool slurps out of the basin it had occupied and engulfs the body, which begins to dissolve. The rest of the party begins to back towards the door while Kiran the fighter jumps in to attack the creature.This was not a wise move as Kiran had been wounded previously. Slicing into it with his greatsword, Kiran sees the creature split in two. One of the blobs stays on the hireling's body while the other strikes at Kiran, blorping on to him and slaying him as well. The party suffers complete morale failure at this point and runs for the door, fleeing out the door, out of the dungeon, and back to the keep. 

DM Notes

I have never managed to have a party get into the Room of Pools in B1 before so I was very happy to see them do it. At some point in the past I had placed the Ochre Jelly(#21) into the dry pool and I decided to keep it there, figuring there should be one terror-inducing monster on the first level and this was definitely the place to do it. Much time was spent checking pools and testing what happened to arrows dipped into them - very refreshing and not something you see a lot of in more modern skill-laden editions - as each character (and the help) went to one pool to check it out. The initial appearance of the Ochre Jelly rattled the apprentices and they were uncertain whether to fight or run, but when it killed the fighter the rout was on.

I was glad the hireling was the one examining that pool - it gave me the chance to demonstrate the jelly's power without insta-killing a PC, always nice when it works out. The warning wasn't heeded though and so another PC paid the price. Some lessons are harder to learn than others.

I did award XP for the last 2 sessions back at the keep and the Thief is now 3rd level and most of the other characters are 2nd, except for the Elf. I allowed the surviving man-at-arms to level up to a 1st level fighter and become a henchman, making him a little more survivable for the future. 

The New Old Campaign - Part 8

The action begins in the Hobgoblin Lair's torture chamber where our heroes are releasing some prisoners. They free a merchant and his wife, who each promise a reward for an escort back to the keep. They then free two men-at-arms who promise to serve for a year if they are freed. Horus the Dwarf and Apollo the Elf each take one of these bondsmen. They also free an Orc as he promises to help fight on the way out of the dungeon. 

The exit is uneventful as the party retraces its steps and heads out. The orc takes his leave once they exit the hobgoblin cave thought the Elf watches him until he can see which cave he enters. Then they depart for the keep.

They remain for 2 days, receive the promised rewards (gold from the merchant, a +1 dagger from his wife) and outfit their new henchmen with decent gear - namely platemail. Then the company sets out again, this time planning to explore the large clearing  they spotted on their initial journey to the caves. Rumor has it that a strange cave lies somewhere in the area, and they intend to explore it.

Our party consists of:

Apollo the Elf, Steven the Thief, Kiran the Fighter, Horus Bloodaxe the Dwarf, Skullduggery II the Magic User, Davyd the Halfling, and 2 Men at Arms

Within an hour of reaching the clearing, they find a rocky hill with a single cave near the top. Inside, a 10' passage leads into darkness. Entering, the push past some old broken doors, pass some niches carved into the walls, (checking for skeletons - see their very first adventure) and are startled when a magic mouth begins speaking in a loud booming voice. It accuses them of being thieves and fools and mentions that Zelligar and Rogahn will deal with them as such. Horus recognizes the names as two of the adventurers that were with Duke Sutherland when he freed Dragonport. They later left the city and were not seen again though there are several legends about them and their possible fate. The rest of the party cares little for stories from 100 years ago and pushes on. 

A short distance later the group comes across a scattering of bodies, apparently an earlier adventuring band that met with ill luck. Examining the bodies the party finds little to learn or loot and continues on through long and winding passages, finding little of interest until they round a corner and see what can only be described as a throne room.

The party finds itself in a large columned room with dual thrones atop a raised dais at the far end. There are also so rough looking men in the room who demand payment for the party's intrusion. Horus tries to negotiate but the humans demand payment, the band refuses, and combat ensues. A few minutes later, the party is looting the bodies of the 4 brigands. Horus finds a shield hanging on the wall emblazoned with an eagle and claims it, thinking it might be worth something.

 Exploring a bit further, the group finds a trophy room full of interesting creatures and creature parts. Among these is a huge dragonskin which fascinates Apollo and he takes it down, rolls it up, and orders one of the retainers to carry it. He plans to make something out of it, possibly armor, or at the very least hang it up in HIS room, not leave it here in some dusty dungeon. 

DM Notes:

This session featured an unexpected turn of events as the apprentices decided that they were taking too many casualties at the caves and wanted to explore the other place they had heard about. I had not specifically placed anything in the "Cave of the Unknown" as I assumed the boys would keep hammering the caves for a while. Since one of the reasons for doing this campaign is to give them a tour of some of the "classics" of D&D, I went to the closet and double-checked the map for B1- yep, it fits perfectly: 1 large cave-like entrance, 2 levels, some cool old-school dungeon type things - so that's the way I went. I had considered using the dungeon from B5 Horror on the Hill but I decided it was more complex than I wanted for this side-trip type dungeon. I plan to use it for an alternate starting area in this same campaign anyway.  SO "In Search of the Unknown" it was.

They liked the entrance area (the mouths, the bodies, etc) but they ignored some of the nearby doors and went off the the East and South on the map, winding down and around to the south east corner and eventually stumbling into the throne room where I had placed the bandits (#20) and a +1 shield (W) - I am using the old lists right from the module as I have never run it in-depth, only having PC's stumble across it then pull out before really digging in and I wanted to see how well it worked. So far I have no complaints.

There wasn't much combat this time, but they spent time exploring and checking torches and oil supplies so it was just fine. The trophy room was a lot of fun and the idea of one of the henchmen walking through this dungeon basically carrying a roll of carpet inspired quite a few laughs. One of the apprentices already has the "who cares he's just a hireling - he'll do what he's told" attitude already and he's never read KODT or Nodwick or anything - it's just a natural development and it's very funny to see in action again after all these years.